TURF WARS: BATTLE #1
Jason Koestenblatt vs. Ross Mandel
Moderator (RIC): Welcome to the first ever Turf Wars Battle featuring the NFL Draft Bible's very own, Jason Koestenblatt and Ross Mandel. Each week they will face off and debate the hot topic of the week.
This week's topic is: "Who is the better quarterback, Peyton Manning or Tom Brady?”
Jason will be defending Tom Brady. Ross will state his case for Peyton Manning.
Up first is Jason.
ROUND 1
JASON: As the quarterback of your team, the guy who leads the offense up and down the field, you want a general. You want a guy that's not just going to huck up numbers in October, but one who's going to make his money from the start of training camp to the end of January, sometimes February. And who better than Tom Brady?
ROSS: I'll tell you "who better than Tom Brady"--Peyton Manning. No longer can you saddle him with the stigma of the quarterback who simply racks up stats, but fails to win the "big one." He won the Super Bowl. He led his team in the regular season AND the playoffs. General Manning has his ring.
Trash Talk: He's got nothing left to say! (ROSS)
ROUND 2
JASON: Brady is a General with a handicapped army. You see, he's never had the talent of a Marvin Harrison, a Reggie Wayne, Edgerrin James or sensational rookie Joseph Addai in his backfield. During the Super Bowl winning seasons, Brady triumphed with guys like Deion Branch, who's good, but he's no Harrison. How about having Antowain Smith and Kevin Faulk in your backfield? Who? Exactly! Brady's practically done it by himself for the past seven seasons, whereas Manning has had all the help he can handle.
Trash Talk: HaHa...Nothing left to say...I was deciding on which point to bury you with (JASON)
ROSS: Handicapped army? Please. I like how you mention Addai, but not Laurence Maroney. And Edge? I think we saw that Peyton made him what he was last season when he left Indy, didn't we? The fact is, Peyton makes everyone around him into the players that they are, through his talent and leadership. And if Brady has been working with depleted troops, what would you call the defense Manning's teams have had? I mean Bridget Moynahan could have run for 100+ yards against them until the end of last season! Manning has had to maintain his poise with a defense which forced him to put 35 on the board every game. Don't talk to me about "poor Brady" and his lack of talent!
ROUND 3
JASON: You know that Indy's defense was at the top of its game during the 2006 postseason. If it wasn't, Manning's 3 touchdowns vs. 7 interceptions in the playoffs wouldn't have helped them win a ring. Although Brady and the Pats lost a tough one to Indy in the AFC Championship, Manning's only been good for boosting numbers during the regular season, not bringing home rings to his fans.
ROSS: So the numbers DON'T matter when Peyton is amassing them throughout his career, but they DO count when he has a couple of bad games? And they DON'T matter when Brady is a "leader" not a stat guy? Well, here are some numbers for you; Manning averages, AVERAGES over 4,000 passing each season. Brady has ONE season over 4,000 yards. Peyton owns the record for TDs in a season with 49. Brady has thrown over 30 TDs in a season ONCE. I could go on and on with Manning’s better QB rating, or his two league MVPs, his superior numbers in every way...but I don't think it's necessary in order to convince everyone. The argument used to be "Manning has never won the big one." With that gone, what's to argue about?
THE BIG QUESTION
(RIC): Jason- You mention that Brady never had the same type of supporting cast as Manning, but some would argue that Brady benefited from the system implemented by Bill Belichick and Co. How do you respond to the argument that Brady is simply a product of the New England system?
JASON: Brady's been around great coaching for his entire career, there's no question about it. But has he lost a step since offensive coordinator Charlie Weis left for South Bend? No way. He's still the same guy that's going to give you a 103.9 rating in the Red Zone, the same guy that you trust with two minutes left in the game. Manning's coaching is a joke. He's a talented guy that calls his own plays, which gets him into trouble sometimes. Brady learned from coach Belichick and dare I say under the tutelage of Drew Bledsoe, and if you drop him on any other team in the league, he's going to make them better without question.
(RIC): Ross-- Many people argued that Manning was not a winner prior to his NFL career. He was notoriously known to have never beaten Florida while he was the man at Tennessee. How much of his reputation for not being able to win the big one at the college level, impacts his overall legacy?
ROSS: I think it impacted his legacy a great deal...before last season. Winning last season's Super Bowl gets rid of all of that. He was known as a guy who couldn't win a big game, in college or the pros. Whether that was fair or not, it doesn't matter--perception was reality. But now that he's won the biggest game there is, how can anyone say that? His legacy will begin with the words, "Super Bowl Winner and MVP". I think any QB, any player, would take that legacy. Now that the monkey is off his back, more rings are sure to follow.
THE FINAL WORD
JASON: There's no doubt both these guys are leaving behind legacies when they head to Canton. But for Brady, his Super Bowl MVPs seemed more earned, whereas the voters of last year's Big Game where too frightened to split the award between Addai and Dominick Rhodes. Manning will go back to the playoffs...this year in fact. And so will Brady, and when they square off, there isn't one Indy DB that will volunteer to say "I'll take Moss." Brady's got the goods, the rings (3), the team and the leadership capabilities to win at least two more before he hangs 'em up. Peyton? All he'll be able to say is "at least I'm better than my brother."
ROSS: Look, this is no longer a "Montana vs. Marino" debate. Manning put an end to that ridiculous comparison last season when he beat Brady with the biggest comeback in Conference Championship history, leading his Colts back from an 18-point deficit. And it wasn't just those 18 points he had to overcome. Sure, the Colts had beaten Brady and the Patriots during the season (and have now won three in a row against the Pats), but he had the ghosts of past failure AND an 18-point deficit to overcome, but he did it. He exorcised the demons. And he didn't need a bogus Tuck Rule, a Vinatieri 48-yard FG in the snow, or a (gasp) Drew Bledsoe relief appearance against the Steelers. He needed his arm, his wits, and his teammates--and he won his FIRST Super Bowl.
(RIC): OK fellas, very strong arguments made by both parties. Now it's time to hand this debate over to the fans--they will decide who the first victor is in our weekly edition of The Turf Wars. Let the voting begin!
10 comments:
Our two participants have spoken. Now its time for you to decide who the winner is.
Let the voting begin!!!
-RIC
Mark one for Ross and Brady. For me, three words sum up Manning: CUT THAT MEAT!
great battle from both sides here. i'm going with brady on this one. i think manning has been given more explosive weapons to work with over the years. if brady pulled on the colts helmet, i think he would put up identical numbers as manning, only he would've won a ring a lot earlier b/c of his poise. manning is one of the greatest football minds i've ever seen. that's the part that makes the decision so difficult. in the end, i say #12 in a photo finish.
I'm going with Brady. It is extremely close but if I had to chose one of these guys to win one game for me its got to be Brady. He has won 3 rings with half the talent Peyton has had. If it wasn't for a miraculous comeback last year, Peyton and the Colts might still have that huge monkey on their back. I still think Brady is in Peytons head. If the two teams played tomorrow and betting were legal, I would take the Pats. What about you?
Great points from both sides. From a technical standpoint, Manning is in a league of his own. The man's arm strength and precision are out of control.
On the flip side, Brady came out of nowhere and now has 3 rings. Based on arguments alone, I gotta give it to Ross for his ability to argue that Brady's intangibles make him the great QB he is.
I'm going to also vote for Brady here. Brady has made something out of nothing multiple seasons. Last year he made a mediocre- at best- receiving squad look like superstars. Manning has had solid help his entire career with the Colts and I highly doubt he would have gotten very far last season with the Patriots offense. Brady is going to prove his superiority this season with the improved receivers and by the end of 2007, there will be no comparison between the two QB's.
This was 1-sided contest that ended after the first few debate topics...KO for Mandel.
Both make a strong arguments, but if I am going to build my fantasy team around one of the two named players if most defiantly would Alexander. What Ross said is true about Gore he did have a great season last year, but as Jason pointed out Alexander has had multiple productive season filled with ridiculous stats and one down year to Frank Gore’s whopping one year of success. One of Ross’s major arguments was that Alexander production was going to drop off just because he has reached the ripe old age of 30, well Ross should check his stats because guys like Curtis Martin, Priest Holmes, Tiki Barber and countless other running backs at and over 30 have had great seasons. Also, how many one hit wonders have we seen in the NFL at running back (see Anthony Thomas “the A train”, give me a break, and half of the Broncos backfield over the past 10 years) and many of those guys didn’t have the injury history that Frank Gore has had and that Ross eludes to in his own argument “Gore has overcome FAR worse injuries” compared to his now broken hand. Bottom line is that Alexander is a far better pick to build your fantasy team around look at his track record he is no flavor of the month like Gore.
As far as I can see, Brady's bloom has fallen from the rose. I'm going with Ross on this one, as he really drove the point home with the final argument--look what Manning had to do to bring a ring to his team. And in the words of Jim Mora, that's pretty much what it all boils down to.
Well said.
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